Quote:

edgar is right. If you're going get disappointed at build quality and feel cheated, you might as well be better of with Korean cars.

I agree wit ian, better test drive before buy!

Remember the build quality and the handling of Saga & Iswara. No even in par with 70's honda. No offend, driving Iswara was like a riding horse, the car is so bouncy and unstable. So light, feels like easy to overturn.

Quote:

Lol, I think you got the wrong idea Ian, when I said go for the Korean, e.g. Hyundai, and you will not disappoint, I meant it. They are really good, build quality inside out is on par with the European made hatches.

Take a browse around the new Hyundai I30, not sure if they sell those in Malaysia, but this is one of the most reputable car under AUD$22,000 at the moment! The diesel variant can run more than 1000km out of a full-tank.

Quote:

Well that's partially what I meant anyway. Because you still get a lot of problems with Korean builds in the end - I have a friend who sells Hyundais. They're not bad, but not something you'd can keep running for over 10 years.

Well, most of their models that were produced 10 years ago, though I must admit, is not the best.

Put that aside, look at the models that were built within the last 2 years, they are much better, and time will tell if they are any good. As far as my instinct tells me, it will last pretty well together with Toyota in terms of reliability.

They are one of the only few manufacturers that offered 5 years Unlimited Warranty for their entire range of models sold in Australian dealership. This is something that many, even the most popular European brands can promise, so it keeps you doubting how well they have improved themselves, to be able to deliver such promises.

The new I30 placed 2nd, ahead of the already famous Toyota Corolla hatch, to everyone's surprise. Fuel consumption, highway, 3.2l/100km, city 4.7l/100.

Now I hate to do this comparison with our national due to brand loyalty, the stupid national-pride-joke loyalty bla bla bla, but look at this:

Hyundai I30

It is selling at the roughly same price with the Proton. Optioned the top of the range with a grand or two and you get 6 airbags and ESP on the already extensive list of standard items, and with ESP, one of the most sought after system in any new cars today.

Proton, no ESP at all in the entire lines. And to sell the lowest of the range, called the Base Line Model, mind you this will not be the name of the model, but just a representation of the platform program it will be based on, as most likely Proton, once again, alongside the other national car manufacturer will come out with some stupid name, or a copy from other manufacturer.

No doubt the Hyundai, will sell at higher price that Proton due to import duty but pay more, you get European quality at one third the price from the German counterparts.

I agree with you generally, the Koreans have achieved the scale of economics for their production line long ago. Proton hasn't even penetrated it yet, hence the huge price advantage.

The 5 years warranty is a marketing gimmick. Surely enough, it also acts as a goal for the car maker to achieve, so that is a good thing. The dealers wouldn't be too happy about it in the long run though.

My experience with European cars is that they don't really wear well either, with the exception of German-made ones and various other ones, like Volvo. Part of the problem is spares availability and expertise to fix them, the other part of the problem is that they just aren't as good as the Japanese themselves.

Most people I know who bought Japanese (and even German) cars complain of water in light housings, wind / tire / engine noise or the odd electrical problem or two. This is compared with broken door handles, electrical window failures and various other more major problems regarded as 'normal wear' on Koreans models.

They aren't as flimsy as Protons though. My friend's 3 year old Saga feels like it will fall apart if I give it a good kick.

Parts for Continental cars aren't meant for our hot and tropical weather that's why they wear faster. Comparing a 10 years old toyota with a similarly aged BMW or a Merc and you can see the difference (don't compare new cars, of course they all look nice and shining). However this only apply for the external parts which are expose to the sunlight (door handle, dashboard etc). Engine and undercarriage else, the continental makes are still superior but maintenance cost is high

I was referring to European cars in general - but while we're comparing 'continental' cars - it is no contest against the best non-luxury Japanese cars on our roads.

The Camrys, Cefiros and Accords on our roads are not considered continental or even 'luxury' in their original intended markets at all. They just happen to 'feel luxurious' enough..

Of the very few that can be considered is Lexus, but most people blindly make apple to orange comparisons. Acura is one Japanese luxury marque that doesn't even exist in Malaysia at this point in time.

German cars of more than 15 years ago require a huge amount of money just to keep going, and while some people do allow for that because they wanted those particular models, it is a problem for most people and in the end, it's just not worth the kind of 'insane investment' to keep it running, it's regarded as more or less an expensive hobby thing in the end.

I should know, because my father owns one and more than a few times in a year requires for it to stay put while waiting for some parts to arrive from Germany. Paid in Euro.

Quote:

Parts for Continental cars aren't meant for hot and tropical weather?

Did you want to retract that statement and have another think?

Because as far as I am concerned in respect to the automotive markets around the world, half of the total sales of European cars ended up in hot/humid climate countries. For example, Australia, Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore, Philipines, Thailand, South Africa, United Arab Emirates, and Southern America

Do not for once, disregard Australia as cold and dry country, it's only in certain parts of the country, where as the rest of the states are pretty much hot(or warm) and humid besides winter. Melbourne, wet/humid most of the time, Brisbane, similar tropical weather just like Malaysia. On top of that, huge number of sales are going around the Middle Eastern Countries, one such examples are the emirates of Arab.

Most popular car manufacturers now does testing in extremely hot deserts and extremely cold weather location during the R&D stage, they are tested to withstand the hottest temperature and also the ability for cold-start.

Even so for the interiors, which uses high-grade plastic and leather. Plastics that does not stain grime, dirt, and scratches itself so easily. Leather that does not sqeeks and wear out in less than 14 months (yes, I am talking about Proton's up-class models with optioned leather pack!).

Door seals that live up to the expectation of what it is supposed to do, sealing, not falling off and produces high wind noise. Also cover-plastic components that does not came off and broke its tab and not being able to put back.

Adequate safety system and equipments, including security. Not buy your car today, have it stolen tomorrow.

Most importantly, engine that sounds and go, efficient, produce low emission since most nations are committed to lowering of green house emission.

Sadly, Proton does not care about all this, all they care is to keep producing cars just to make all Malaysian feel proud that the national car manufacturer are doing 'OK' and they are so ahead in the industries because they have nothing but an impressive list of models line-up, all useless machinery.

To claim they are cheap are not exactly true either, since it is locally made, uses the cheapest and the lowest grade for the materials (even skimming on tyres, how sad), applied the least technology and safety measures, and still selling at premium price at the same level with imports. What you don't see is the import duty that escalate the prices of imports, otherwise, everyone would be rushing mad to realise how cheap and better quality a car of Korean or Japanese made.

They might as well call the new base-line model, a Proton Suicide.

Quote: I think you're refering to reconning cars from their country thru 3rd party. if you spend your $ to local malaysia authorise dealer & they cook up the story about "not meant for our hot & tropical weather", can complain in their website until their pants drop. because they probably parallel import it & then sell as authorise first hand...